Hodgdon Longshot...

[BCB]

I know it is a fairly slow burner, but has anyone used it for light cast boolit loads in the 357, 44, or 45?

I was thinking in the range of 800+ fps for the 45 Colt with a 228 grainer...

I presently use Unique, TiteGroup, Hp-38, etc...

I know these are better powders, faster burning, but I have a canister of the Longshot and thought I might give it a try...

Thanks...BCB

[Walkingwolf]

Longshot is no good for light to moderate light loads, it needs pressure to perform. I use Longshot because it performs, and it easy to find. I use titegroup for most of my less than kick **** loads, which is most of my needs. Where longshot, and W296 come into play are in 38spl +P, and 38/44. I use longshot for our Rossi 352, and W296 for my GP100.

138 gr WC Bayou Bullet Long Shot 5.5 gr 1.275 900fps Rossi 352 2 inch barrel

158 gr SWC Bayou Bullet W296 14 gr 1.475 1200fps Ruger GP100 4 inch barrel

[tazman]

I have used Longshot in 9mm and 40S&W where it performs extremely well. I am about to try it in 38 Special+P and 357 magnum. I expect it to perform well there also.
Walkingwolf is correct that it isn't good for light loads. Lots of other powder out there for light loads. I use Bullseye, WST, and Titegrup in the vast majority of my light loads.

[Ramjet-SS]

Really good powder for 10MM

[runfiverun]

I just picked up some of this to give a go in the 41 mag, I was initially thinking about using it a semi-replacement for 2400 but I think it may not burn just right for that.
I suppose i'll find out later as I'm involved with a couple of other projects ATM.

[richbug]

Probably best to look at it as a replacement for Blue Dot.

If you can find blue dot data for a given combo, probably safe to assume you can make longshot work in the same application(with changes to charge weight).

[sig2009]

Great powder for 9mm major loads!

[BCB]

Still messing with this Longshot and trying to compare data from here and there and QuickLoad…

I know QuickLoad is not “gawd’s gift to absolute”, but I still used it as a guide…

I chose a 10 grain charge for all the powders listed below and applied it to the 452-228-2R boolit in the 45 Colt using a Blackhawk…

Accurate # 5…969 fps-----------------10744 psi
LONGSHOT… 962 fps---------------10776 psi
Hodgdon HS-6…928 fps----------------9890 psi
Blue Dot…747 fps----------------------6054 psi
Accurate # 7…724 fps-----------------5415 psi
2400…639 fps--------------------------4274 psi

This stuff seems much closer to AA#5 of HS-6 than the other slower powders in its ballpark according to the burn rate charts…

Strange days indeed…

Good-luck…BCB

[nicholst55]

I bought some Longshot to use in .40 S&W, where it excelled. I lost interest in the cartridge and sold my Glock, then tried Longshot in .45 ACP - not so good. The .45 ACP is a relatively low-pressure cartridge, and I experienced sooty cases with every load I tried. Guess I'll try the rest of my Longshot in .480 Ruger and see how it works there.

[wrench man]

I picked up a couple of pounds to try out, in my 20ga with 1oz loads, but I intend to see how it works in my 40S&W and 45ACP too.

[nvreloader]

BCB,

Here is the Burn rate of the powders you posted,
--------------------------------------------------------

Burn rate factor, The burning rate coefficient during combustion of powder. Fast to Slow

Hodgdon Longshot = 2.5900
Accurate No 5 = 2.5041
Hodgdon HS 6 = 2.4500
Alliant Blue Dot = 1.5400
Accurate No 7 = 1.4180
Alliant 2400 = 1.1471

----------------------------------------------------------
Powder heat of the explosion,
The energy content per unit mass of specified powder.
Hot to Cold

Accuratete No 5 = 4500
Alliant Blue Dot = 4380
Alliant 2400 = 4220
Accurate No 7 = 4160
Hodgdon Longshot = 4000
Hodgdon HS 6 = 3980

--------------------------------------------------------------
Ratio of specific heat,
The ratio of consent pressure of specific heat,
to the constant volume of specific heat.
Hot to Cold

Hodgdon Longshot = 1.2160
Accurate No 5 = 1.2191
Hodgdon HS 6 = 1.2221
Accurate No 7 = 1.2270
Alliant 2400 = 1.2310
Alliant Blue Dot = 1.2370

----------------------------------------------------------------


Hope this helps,


Tia,
Don

Still messing with this Longshot and trying to compare data from here and there and QuickLoad…
I know QuickLoad is not “gawd’s gift to absolute”, but I still used it as a guide…
I chose a 10 grain charge for all the powders listed below and applied it to the 452-228-2R boolit in the 45 Colt using a Blackhawk…
Accurate # 5…969 fps-----------------10744 psi
LONGSHOT… 962 fps---------------10776 psi
Hodgdon HS-6…928 fps----------------9890 psi
Blue Dot…747 fps----------------------6054 psi
Accurate # 7…724 fps-----------------5415 psi
2400…639 fps--------------------------4274 psi

This stuff seems much closer to AA#5 of HS-6 than the other slower powders in its ballpark according to the burn rate charts…
Strange days indeed…
Good-luck…BCB

[BCB]

I mentioned in the original post that I was interested in Longshot and the 45 Colt with light loads using the 452-228-1R Lee boolit…

Well, instead I switched to the 357 Magnum and the 358-150-2R Lee boolit as there was better data for the Longshot powder and bullets in the 158 range. The data for the 45 Colt was for “Ruger Only” loads and that is not my goal…

Quickload predicted that the burn rates for the powders I chose to shoot with the same charges are as follows, from fastest to slowest—Longshot, AA#5, Blue Dot, & AA#7. This is shown in the post by nvreloader—it appears this data he posted was taken from the QuickLoad program of which I also have and use…

I was shooting 6 grains of the above powders with the 358-150-2R boolit…


Longshot=914 fps

AA#5=796 fps (I thought this powder should have produced another 100 fps, but it didn’t)

Blue Dot=697 fps

AA#7=530 fps (Accuracy was so bad that I am surprised I didn’t kill my Chrony at 10 feet!)


Regardless, I shot at targets at 30 feet with the Chrony being at 10 feet. All 3-shot groups could be covered easily with a quarter with the exception of the AA#7 group. I was shooting them from a Security-Six that was manufactured in the 1^st couple of years of their production—what a nice shooter…

What’s also interesting is the fact that the burn rate charts show Longshot as being the slowest of the 4—this doesn’t seem to be true, but the opposite, at least with the 357 Magnum…

Now that I have a bit of a “feel” for Longshot, I might try the 45 Colt with it and some loads that are reduced from the recommended “Ruger Only” loads…

Good-luck…BCB

[denul]

In Handloader 283, Brian Pearce gives a glowing review of this powder behind the RCBS 270gr SAA boolit,in a New Model 45 Colt Blackhawk(357 frame). He recommends against "Ruger only" loads in this gun,as many others do,but favors loads above factory 45 Colt. He concluded that Longshot could safely drive a 285 grain cast version of the 270 SAA to 1050 fps, and remain below 23000 psi. (He states the Ruger Only loads are 32000 psi).
He records very good accuracy,and insignificant velocity variations with powder position. This article also features lighter charges of Longshot for the modern Smith and Wesson double action 45 Colts that still exceed factory pressures. Seems like a good fit for what you are doing.

[BCB]

In Handloader 283, Brian Pearce gives a glowing review of this powder behind the RCBS 270gr SAA boolit,in a New Model 45 Colt Blackhawk(357 frame). He recommends against "Ruger only" loads in this gun,as many others do,but favors loads above factory 45 Colt. He concluded that Longshot could safely drive a 285 grain cast version of the 270 SAA to 1050 fps, and remain below 23000 psi. (He states the Ruger Only loads are 32000 psi).
He records very good accuracy,and insignificant velocity variations with powder position. This article also features lighter charges of Longshot for the modern Smith and Wesson double action 45 Colts that still exceed factory pressures. Seems like a good fit for what you are doing.

Thanks...

I went to my Handloader collection and found #283. I remember it from back then, but I had not much interest in it as I wasn't even thinking about Longshot...

Now then, the part I'm a bit confused about is what frame is on my Blackhawk. It is a New Model so does that mean it is a 357 frame?...

I thought mine was the heavier frame, but maybe they didn't make that in the New Model. I haven't shot any of the super heavy duty loads from it, but I have shot some fairly heavies using the 45-270-SAA and H-110. Maybe I shouldn't shoot those anymore?...

I started with 7 and 8 grains of Longshot and the Lee 452-228-1R. The velocity was 400-500+ fps as one might guess. Although I was going to error on the low pressure side rather than the "go crazy" pressure side. I am going to shoot 9 and 10 grains today...

But, the 228 grain boolit just might be too light to be using Longshot as others have hinted to--No pressure build-up as might happen easier with the 45-270-SAA...

Oh well, we shall see what we shall see...

Thanks...BCB

[BCB]

Longshot and the Lee 452-228-1R…

7 grains = 451 fps
8 grains = 530 fps
9 grains =643 fps
10 grains = 731 fps

No way was I going to get close to the velocities mentioned in Handloader 283…

Reckon it was because he was using a much heavier boolit—45-270-SAA—more pressure…

Although I shoot that boolit from time to time, I’m not going to try it with Longshot—probably defeat the purpose of a light low recoil load…

I do use faster burners with the Lee boolit will good results. Eight grains of Unique or 5 grains of Bullseye have been the choice with Unique probably having the edge with accuracy for sure…

Oh well, got to try different stuff and hope for a real “winner”. One that puts all three boolits in the same hole even if you just “sort of” aim at the target—the reloaders dream…

And so it goes…BCB

[denul]

BCB, I owe you an apology. You are absolutely correct that longshot is more suited to the heavier bullets, and that is true in other calibers besides 45 Colt as well. You had posted that you were looking for lower recoiling loads, with lighter bullets. Bear hunting loads probably don't exactly meet those specifications. I hope I didn't cause you to burn some powder unnecessarily, & I realized it after I put together some heavier 357 longshot loads today that were more intense in recoil than the chronograph would suggest.

[BCB]

BCB, I owe you an apology. You are absolutely correct that longshot is more suited to the heavier bullets, and that is true in other calibers besides 45 Colt as well. You had posted that you were looking for lower recoiling loads, with lighter bullets. Bear hunting loads probably don't exactly meet those specifications. I hope I didn't cause you to burn some powder unnecessarily, & I realized it after I put together some heavier 357 longshot loads today that were more intense in recoil than the chronograph would suggest.

Hell, you don’t owe me an apology!!!...

The article gave me some charges he used for heavier boolits. So, I sort of used those as guidelines and approached those numbers, but with a lighter boolit…

Longshot appears to be burn-rate specific to what cartridge it is dumped into. It actually performed fairly well with the 357 Magnum and a 150 grain boolit…

It appears the volume size of the 45 Colt simply will not allow light charges of Longshot even though the 357 Magnum shows the powder to be faster burning than most charts indicate. Longshot must have a considerable slower burn rate in the 45 compared to the 357…

Oh well, as we handloaders know, it is always fun (if we error on the side of safety!) to step into the unknown from time to time…

As far as wasting powder—I just calculated the cost, 68¢ total for all the loads tested. I’ve been dang poor a few times in my life, but never poor enough that 68¢ was going to finalize the Poor House!!!...

Good-luck…BCB

[nicholst55]

Now then, the part I'm a bit confused about is what frame is on my Blackhawk. It is a New Model so does that mean it is a 357 frame?...

I thought mine was the heavier frame, but maybe they didn't make that in the New Model.

If your Ruger has adjustable sights and a flat top strap (the so-called Flattop model), then it is the medium-sized frame. Same thing if it has fixed sights and the receiver is marked 'New Vaquero.' If it has 'ears' to protect the rear adjustable sight, or is a fixed-sight gun marked 'Vaquero,' then it is the large frame.

[BCB]

If your Ruger has adjustable sights and a flat top strap (the so-called Flattop model), then it is the medium-sized frame. Same thing if it has fixed sights and the receiver is marked 'New Vaquero.' If it has 'ears' to protect the rear adjustable sight, or is a fixed-sight gun marked 'Vaquero,' then it is the large frame.

Are the "ears" you are taking about the ridges that run beside the rear sight?...

Note: those are not factory rear sights...

Pic included--maybe!!!

Thanks...BCB