Is there a press mounted powder measure that's consistent to .01 gr?

[MtGun44]

The correct answer is NO.

The second point to make is that powder charge precision beyond 0.1 grain (NOT gram)
makes no difference practical in accuracy in rifle and extremely tiny difference in most pistol loads,
so the question is moot.

Bill

[daddyseal]

BIG +1.
Buying top quality brass saves a ton of prep time.
Internal volume and neck tension variations will do far more damage than 0.1grains of powder!
Those benchresters have tried every trick in the book at one time or another, they even tried some 2,3,4 times.

When I begin reloading rifle ammo, I'll keep all that in mind...right now just 7 calibers of pistol.

[smokeywolf]

RCE1 mentioned Lapua brass; good stuff. I've also been pleased with Norma brass.

Brass prep and sorting is quite important to me. Especially sorting brass by weight, because I weigh finished cartridges as a final safety measure.

smokeywolf

[MBTcustom]

Alright, I can't stand it anymore!
DS, you gonna tell us what your shooting and what groups you're laying down?
Spill the beans man!
I'm visualizing 1/2" groups from a vice mounted model 29.......am I close? Perhaps a contender? Oh, I know, K38 Target Masterpiece?

[daddyseal]

Alright, I can't stand it anymore!
DS, you gonna tell us what your shooting and what groups you're laying down?
Spill the beans man!
I'm visualizing 1/2" groups from a vice mounted model 29.......am I close? Perhaps a contender? Oh, I know, K38 Target Masterpiece?

LOL...not hardly, friend.
I'm about to start reloading for my rifles(both scoped)....243 Browning BAR Safari MkII, and 1891 Argentine Mauser.
But for a good while it's been pistols and wheel guns.
My favorite handgun is my 6.5" .44 magnum revolver...I get 4" groups at 17 yrds.

[jmorris]

Lots of other stuff to look at except powder charges that vary by as much as a half a grain, to shrink 4" group size at 17 yds.

[FLHTC]

I was prepared to see four pages of powder measure comments but the subject really drifted off the mark. I know there are those who have their favorite measure but i haven't found a measure to be perfect for all powders or charge weights. Flake meters different than ball and stick meters different than both of them.

[daddyseal]

Lots of other stuff to look at except powder charges that vary by as much as a half a grain, to shrink 4" group size at 17 yds.

You mean sorting cases by makers, and sorting by weigh and length?
I do those things now, jmorris.

[MBTcustom]

I would be looking at boolit design and fit, powder type, and seating depth. Any of those things could be a factor.
Also, there is the firearm itself. Consider cylinder alignment, trigger weight, barrel condition (especially the first 1/2" in front of the forcing cone and the crown.)
Lots of fun stuff to work on!

[daddyseal]

I would be looking at boolit design and fit, powder type, and seating depth. Any of those things could be a factor.
Also, there is the firearm itself. Consider cylinder alignment, trigger weight, barrel condition (especially the first 1/2" in front of the forcing cone and the crown.)
Lots of fun stuff to work on!

These are what I load http://www.bslbullet.com/210-grain-r...base-p-35.html
I've slugged the barrel at .430
My powder, so far, has been WIN231 with 12.5grs.
Seated at 1.645
It's a Taurus (please don't laugh) and the barrel is good on the revolver with only about 300 rds thru it.
The single action trigger is very short, and just over 3.5 lbs.
The crown is excellent.
Please tell me how to the check cylinder alignment, so I can, friend.

[Frozone]

Here is a good read on the subject.
You can easily make your own rods or get one from Brownells.

[daddyseal]

Here is a good read on the subject.
You can easily make your own rods or get one from Brownells.

That is great~!
What is the source?...I'd like to see what other information they have, friend!

[Recluse]

I did not think you were criticizing me in the least, friend.
I too, have enjoyed all the input, and have learned~

And likewise, no criticism here but rather some points to consider while you're at the starting blocks of your reloading journey--

• Your firearm plays an equal role in accuracy as do your loads. This is why most handloaders do what we do. I know each of my firearms, their particulars, their quirks, their likes and dislikes, etc etc., and I tailor my precision handloads accordingly.

• I've found that powder weight is the least significant factor in accuracy loading. Volume of powder, type of powder, condition of (brass) case, bullet/boolit specifics and condition, lube (if applicable), combination of type of primer in conjunction with type of powder and how much powder, crimp of bullet/boolit, OAL, etc. . . all factors that contribute to handloading consistent rounds to give top-shelf consistent accuracy.

• Many years ago when I would shoot bullseye matches with .44 Special, I annealed my brass after every six firings, separated the brass by number of firings, constantly checked the trim length (even though it was extremely rare that I ever needed to even give a whisper touch with the case trimmer), chamfered the brass so as to ensure a consistent crimp, etc etc. I was convinced that all of this was making a huge difference.

Not really. A little, but not enough to give me any significant ROI on all that time and work.

This isn't to say it's okay to be sloppy but rather that for handgun shooting, there are a gazillion factors outside of your control that will adversely affect accuracy. A few are:

--Weather. Varying barometric pressures will affect bullet flight. So will wind. So will extreme temperatures depending upon the distance you're shooting.

--Conditions while reloading. If it's overly humid in your reloading shop or area, this can affect the weight of your powder charges depending upon the type and structure of the powder you're using and how much of a charge it is getting. I read where one reloader was getting lighter charges and we couldn't figure out WHY. Seems his ceiling fan was going and was giving just enough of a downdraft on his bench to adversely affect his measuring scales--both of them, the expensive Ohaus as well as the digital.

--Conditions affecting the firearm when shooting. We all know that some guns fire better with a warm barrel and others are just fine with a cold barrel (although I'd love to have one of those as I never have ). How long are you taking between shots and is it allowing the barrel to cool? Is it a hot Texas day in the high-90's and the barrel is getting hotter faster than it would in January? Etc etc.

And then of course, there is US, the actual shooter. We already know everything that can adversely affect us.

I enjoy the journey more than the destination, so for me, handloading is an endless journey of learning and discovery. My ultimate quest is to develop the ultimate load for each situation possible for each of my firearms.

Even after forty years, that destination is still way off in the sunset, but I'm enjoying the journey.

[drklynoon]

DS, I would, if I could afford it, buy several different factories ammunition and give them a try. If one way outperforms the others than you have a boolit weight and speed to work with. If all of them shoot 4" I would then look at the gun and your shooting techniques. A grip change can have an enormous effect on accuracy. At the kind of yardage in which you are shooting it can be hard to determine reloading effects.

[daddyseal]

And likewise, no criticism here but rather some points to consider while you're at the starting blocks of your reloading journey--

• Your firearm plays an equal role in accuracy as do your loads. This is why most handloaders do what we do. I know each of my firearms, their particulars, their quirks, their likes and dislikes, etc etc., and I tailor my precision handloads accordingly.

• I've found that powder weight is the least significant factor in accuracy loading. Volume of powder, type of powder, condition of (brass) case, bullet/boolit specifics and condition, lube (if applicable), combination of type of primer in conjunction with type of powder and how much powder, crimp of bullet/boolit, OAL, etc. . . all factors that contribute to handloading consistent rounds to give top-shelf consistent accuracy.

• Many years ago when I would shoot bullseye matches with .44 Special, I annealed my brass after every six firings, separated the brass by number of firings, constantly checked the trim length (even though it was extremely rare that I ever needed to even give a whisper touch with the case trimmer), chamfered the brass so as to ensure a consistent crimp, etc etc. I was convinced that all of this was making a huge difference.

Not really. A little, but not enough to give me any significant ROI on all that time and work.

This isn't to say it's okay to be sloppy but rather that for handgun shooting, there are a gazillion factors outside of your control that will adversely affect accuracy. A few are:

--Weather. Varying barometric pressures will affect bullet flight. So will wind. So will extreme temperatures depending upon the distance you're shooting.

--Conditions while reloading. If it's overly humid in your reloading shop or area, this can affect the weight of your powder charges depending upon the type and structure of the powder you're using and how much of a charge it is getting. I read where one reloader was getting lighter charges and we couldn't figure out WHY. Seems his ceiling fan was going and was giving just enough of a downdraft on his bench to adversely affect his measuring scales--both of them, the expensive Ohaus as well as the digital.

--Conditions affecting the firearm when shooting. We all know that some guns fire better with a warm barrel and others are just fine with a cold barrel (although I'd love to have one of those as I never have ). How long are you taking between shots and is it allowing the barrel to cool? Is it a hot Texas day in the high-90's and the barrel is getting hotter faster than it would in January? Etc etc.

And then of course, there is US, the actual shooter. We already know everything that can adversely affect us.

I enjoy the journey more than the destination, so for me, handloading is an endless journey of learning and discovery. My ultimate quest is to develop the ultimate load for each situation possible for each of my firearms.

Even after forty years, that destination is still way off in the sunset, but I'm enjoying the journey.

Excellent~!!
Thank you, friend~

[375RUGER]

In order to get the kind of accuracy and consistency talked about here, you would have to start with the powder. Each and every granule of your powder, say Alliant 2400, would have to be precisely the same shape, dimensions and weight, in order for a mechanical device (your measure) to dispense exactly the same volume and weight each and every time.
Since you will never find any powder where the kernels are all of identical shape, size and density, you are chasing a dream.

smokeywolf

And not only that, but if you are wanting to weigh your powder to that accuracy level you won't be sorting cases by weight- you'll be sorting them by the exact measured internal volume and throwing a different charge for each and every case. If you want to fork over the bucks we can develop a super accurate powder trickler and software to control it if your scale has some form of IO, i.e. RS232, USB, etc. The limitation will be the granule size of the powder you choose. In fact, the software could even be developed to throw a specific charge for the exact weight of each case that is placed on the scale.
You're also going to need a dead calm indoor range to even realize any benefit from such an obsession.

Anyway, I had a Dillon pm that would throw 700-X to within .05 grains. I haven't checked my new one to see how good it throws 700-X.

Here's a good read for you.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...ight=warehouse
there is some discussion of different powder measures, and some of the finer points for real accurate shooting.

[MBTcustom]

If there is any misalignment from the cylinder throat and the barrel, it can be seen pretty easily with the naked eye by looking down the barrel if you don't mind doing so while the gun is in the cocked position. Make very sure that the gun is unloaded!
Clean the face of the cylinder vary well, so that its nice and shiny.
Use a small pen light or bore-light to look down the barrel.
Let your eye relax and find center of the firing pin hole.
In your peripheral vision, you should see a slight reflection of the cylinder throat, evenly around the grooves of the rifling.
It should look like a total solar eclipse.
If you determine that more light is definitely reflecting from one side of the throat, then your cylinder is out of time.
The human eye is capable of aligning circular objects or determining there eccentricity with alarming precision, and a misalignment of only .0015 is detectable using this system.
Another test is to try to wiggle the cylinder while the hammer is back and observe how much play you have.
I am sorry to say that Taurus and Rossi have consistently produced guns that have a shocking amount of rotational play, but there are a few good 'uns out there. Seems like its about 50/50.
A third test, is to slug your barrel (I know you said you already did) and feel if the slug gets tight just before the slug pops out. This is an indication that you have "thread choke", caused by the barrel threads squeezing the first 1/2" of the barrel so tightly that the diameter of the barrel is actually reduced slightly (Ruger is famous for this).
A fourth test is to make chamber castings of all 6 chambers and see if the throats are the same diameter, and to make sure that they are all .0005 - .002 larger than the groove diameter. Many revolvers have variances in the cylinder throats and that makes it so that every chamber has "a mind of it's own". If you go to the range, and use a sharpy marker to mark one chamber, and you fire 5 cartridges out of that one chamber, and all of a sudden your groups are cut in half, chances are that you have something going on in the throats of your cylinders.
If all of these things check out, then the gun should shoot accurately. I might also add that if you have a taurus that does not fail at least two if these tests, you should hang onto it because it is special. I have had much better luck with S&W revolvers, but I have seen a few dogs there too. The difference is that the S&W is worth fixing (not to diss your pistol in the slightest! Just giving my honest opinion!) No offence intended whatsoever.
There are fixes for each and every one of these problems (within reason), and if you are adept at using hand tools and working metal, you could probably do it yourself. If not, you might want to get with your gunsmith and ask him if these things are bad enough to warrant repair work. If he says yes, then call up Taurus and see about sending the gun back for repair.
I hope this helps.

[jmorris]

You mean sorting cases by makers, and sorting by weigh and length?
I do those things now, jmorris.

No, I mean like make sure your sights are not moving around between shots. You could load your bullets backwards and do better than that, powder charge is not your problem.

[daddyseal]

And not only that, but if you are wanting to weigh your powder to that accuracy level you won't be sorting cases by weight- you'll be sorting them by the exact measured internal volume.

You must be talking about rifle reloading...I'm talking about my .44 magnum revolver here (mostly)

[r1kk1]

Daddyseal I think JM was saying is look to other areas as a 4" group at 17 yds wasn't good. What is the load you are currently using? I had a Taurus in 357 that loved gas checked bullets more than plain base. 44man who contributes quite a bit to this list, I believe shoots groups under two inches at 100 yds. Don't quote me on that. I find my Dan Wesson really likes heavy for caliber bullets. It will shoot plain base and gas checked very well. I like H4227 and H110/296 for powders and CCI 350 for primers.

All in all there is a lot you can do for the firearm alone. As I get older, I need better sights. There have been some really great tips on this forum provided to you.

http://www.sixguns.com/BookOfThe44/

This is a very good read.

Also evaluate the pistol rest your using. What reloading setup are you using. There are more variables than can be imagined.

Take care brother and I originally misread your post about .01 not .1

r1kk1