Bertram Brass

[KCSO]

Mayhaps one of our fiends from Australia can tell me? Is all Bretram Brass as bad as the stuff they ship here? I just got done MAKING 40 rounds of Bretram 6.5X58 rimmed into shootable brass. This was all NEW ordered from Buffalo Arms and was nice shiney brass but it in no way was usable as delivered. Rim thickness varied wildly from .05 undersize to .012 oversize. Cases were up to .10 longer to .05 shorter. The base of the cases was oversized and NONE would fit in the gun without being turned to size and to top it off 2 case had loose primer pockets fron the box and had to be discarded, at $3.00 each!
Good thing I fired one sample round before I reloaded the rest because that round split on the first firing and i HAD TO ANNEAL THE REST OF THE CASE.

This will be the third time I have had to use Bertram Brass and in each case the bras was at best KIT brass. One whole box of 25 Stevens long had rims so undersize they were unusable.

[fredj338]

Not from Aussi, but the Bertram 45 basic brass I had was fine brass, better than some other. It may be caliber specific issue.

[Guesser]

I use Bertram cases in 43 Spanish, I find the quality control to wander far and wide. I have one batch that has served me very long and well, another batch started failing after only two load cycles. I only use one bullet and one powder and the same techniques for prep and load thru the firing sequence. I would like to find a batch of the old B.E.L.L. 43 Spanish cases, I have 20 and the quality is superb. Oh well; when you're shooting an obsolete round in a 130+ yr. old rifle I consider myself lucky to be able to do it at all.

[shooter93]

I've loaded for a lot of obscure rounds over the years and Bertram is always my last pick for brass type. I anneal the neck area of every round before I do anything with it anymore and rim thickness does vary at times which is a real bummer.

[John in PA]

Do Jamison or Starline make what you want? they seem reasonable for quality. Also, Dave at Rocky Mountain Cartridge can make anything, but you may have a good wait, and prices are higher.

[KCSO]

No this is a REAL obscure ctg for a drilling and there is nothing I can make the brass from either. I can't say I am too happy with the C and H dies I got either, the sizer won't neck the cases small enough to hold a 266 bullet and the seater die won't crimp and the expander die won't even touch the inside of the necks as it runs 263! This for $100 dies! I size the necks in a 6.5x55 and I modified a Leed F/C die to work with the longer rimmed brass, but it shoots! 16x16x6.5x58 rimmed and set triggers on the rifle barrel.

[John Boy]

Guesser, you got me curious about the 43 Spanish brass. I bought 50 from BACO, their reformed brass from 348's - not Bertram. Here's the results:
43 Spanish Cases* 2.250" Long
43SPAN

635 Rim Dia Spec ... one case measured at 10 locations ranged from 604 to 608
082 Rim Thickness Spec ... measured 10 cases out of 50. Thickness ranged from 075 to 083
Specifications Source: Cartridges of the World

[sav300]

Hi folks.In regard to Bertrams brass,he would like to know the problems people have with the brass.If he does not know of the problem,how can it be fixed???? Will try to find his details and post here.

[eagle27]

Hi folks.In regard to Bertrams brass,he would like to know the problems people have with the brass.If he does not know of the problem,how can it be fixed???? Will try to find his details and post here.

I'm surprised at these comments as Bruce has been in the cartridge case making business now for 25 years and shouldn't really need to hear of problems from the people buying his cases. In this line of business there should be good tight quality control and perhaps this is what is missing.

There was an informative article on Bruce and his case manufacturing business in issue 120 of our NZ Guns and Hunting magazine accompanied by quite a few close up and clear photos of some of the process stages. I have heard and seen complaints about Bertram brass although I have never used any myself or seen first hand any examples of poor quality.

I must admit that on looking through the article, some of the photos published caused me to question just how good would the brass be at the end of the line.
The ones that really caught my eye were those of the imported raw material brass cups Bruce purchases to start the manufacturing process off with which look to me to have been drawn rather unevenly and this is continued even more so in photos of the brass after it has been drawn into the case length. Obviously it will be trimmed but just how this mates concentrically to the case base I don't know.

The article states that the brass is annealed quite often throughout the drawing stages and a photo shows a run of cases being annealed. I have seen an annealing ring setup similar to this before only the cases were spun so the flame heat was applied very evenly (as I and many others who post here do when annealing our own cases). The Bertram annealing ring directs gas flames from two sides only with the brass sitting stationary in quite large heat sink holes.

I think Bruce and his company are dedicated to producing those hard to get cases for the shooting fraternity but there must be some part or parts of the process that let down the quality side for there to be the amount of dissatisfaction with Bertram brass that there appears to be, or is it only a small drop in the ocean of disgruntled customers?

[Wayne Smith]

No this is a REAL obscure ctg for a drilling and there is nothing I can make the brass from either. I can't say I am too happy with the C and H dies I got either, the sizer won't neck the cases small enough to hold a 266 bullet and the seater die won't crimp and the expander die won't even touch the inside of the necks as it runs 263! This for $100 dies! I size the necks in a 6.5x55 and I modified a Leed F/C die to work with the longer rimmed brass, but it shoots! 16x16x6.5x58 rimmed and set triggers on the rifle barrel.

Call Dave @ CH4D and let him know of the problem with the dies. He has been quite cooperative with me in the past. If you are not satisfied, and the results you post clearly show why, he needs to know.