Pressurize the lube reservoir?

[rbstern]

Has anybody used an air compressor to push the lube thru an RCBS (or Lyman) size/lube machine? I was thinking about threading the cap of the lubrisizer to accept a standard air connector, and drilling/tapping the body and cap to hold the cap in place on the body, with some type of gasket in place to reduce air leakage.

Comments, suggestions, helpful hints and/or dire warnings greatly appreciated.

[mooman76]

Someone here did, but I don't remmeber who.

[bohokii]

why not just rig up some kind of spring or elastic bungee to keep the lever tight

you know take a bungee wrap it around the shaft once then attch it to the table and the other end to the lever

[geargnasher]

I was thinking of making a link between the handle and the ratcheting wrench I use to index the pressure screw so it pressurizes right at the end of the stroke, perhaps rigging the link with a slotted section and strong spring kind of like a carburetor choke pull-off that would slide free through the normal sizer handle stroke and just apply pressure with the spring near the end of the stroke (bottom), thus applying the exact same amount of pressure to the wrench handle each time. I would make the link adjustable to push the screw further or less depending upon lube groove volume.

I think about this every time I sit down and lube a batch of boolits, keeps my mind busy!

The air is an interesting idea, I just wonder how practical it would be to regulate it just right. My Lyman 450 leaks lube out the bottom past the die (worse with RCBS dies) and if you used compressed aire you would need to plug the reservoir screw hole in the bottom somehow, maybe a simple 3/8" X 3/4" bolt and nut with a nylon gasket (read: milk jug) would do the trick. If you try this, please report back to let us know how it worked.

Gear

[Mk42gunner]

I have read a lot of these threads, and thought about it; but my particular RCBS lubamatic leaks up thru the H and I dies if too much pressure is left on. If I have a lot of pressure it leaks very quickly, (like every other boolit has a 1/4" of lube on the bottom), if just a little pressure when I am done, overnight I will have a caliber size stick of lube an inch or two long. I use an interchangable bit screwdriver to apply pressure to lube the boolits, it just takes a slight tweek to the handle every second or third boolit.

It doesn't matter if the dies are RCBS or Lyman, or the diameter either.


Robert

[3006guns]

My faithful old Lachmiller came with a forked link that operated the wrench a tiny bit with each stroke. Only problem was that the fork is rather soft metal, so wear set in after a couple of years and the wrench wouldn't advance far enough. I just give the wrench a little hit every other boolit and it works fine.

The idea of air pressure is tempting, but you'd have to carefully regulate it or excess lube will begin oozing out between sizings.......or so I would think. Perhaps a hand or foot operated valve?

[Ron]

My RCBS original lub a matic which I bought back in the early 70's had that same system as the Lachmiller and yes the metal was a bit soft and did wear. Not only that but the quarter inch ratchet that came with it also wore so between the two parts wearing out it no longer works. The ratchet still works manually & I just give it a tweak every other boolit. I suppose after all these years, something had to give.

[JIMinPHX]

The picture below shows a push through lubrasizer that I made several months ago. The big knob in the back adjusts the preload pressure on a spring that keeps the lube pressurized. A valve then opens & closes when the boolit is pushed up into a Lyman style sizing die.

[rbstern]

Jim, that's really nice looking work you've done. Any chance you'll go to market with it?

[rbstern]

If you try this, please report back to let us know how it worked.

Will do. Thinking about taking a ride over to the local machine shop, to have them thread the top fitting on my RCBS Lubrisizer.

[462]

Jim,
Excellent work...and ingenious, too.

[mag44uk]

I think about something like this too everytime I am sizing!
How about this?
Use a geared down electric motor operated by a foot switch,like a sewing machine. Or some sort of stepper motor.
Just needs a sub base to mount it on somehow.
Hmmmmmmmmmm!
Tony

[rbstern]

Fellas, not only is it possible, but it's pretty easy and works really well.

I got to the following result after several hours of drilling, tapping, fitting, gasketing and experimenting with different air pressure settings:



Cost of materials to pressurize the RCBS Lubrimatic was less than $20. I've taken a bunch of pics of what I did. I will write it up tonight and post it.

[rbstern]

Replacing the mechanical lube pressure system with air pressure on the RCBS Lub-a-matic:

Materials used
- Cork gasketing material (sold in sheets at automotive stores)
- Plumbers tape
- 10 mm x 1.5 x 30mm hex bolt (Crown Bolt upc #30699-36068...Home Depot)
- (2) 4-40 screws, 1/2" length
- 1' length cut from end of PVC air hose (50' hose for $9.99 at Home Depot)
- Small hose clamp (3/8" to 7/8" or similar)

Tools used
- 10mm x 1.50 tap
- 4-40 tap
- #43 drill bit
- 1/8" drill bit
- Drill press (not essential, just makes some of the drilling easier)
- Cordless drill
- Metal cutting wheel or hacksaw
- Air compressor
- Handtools (screwdrivers, center punch, etc.)


The cap assembly:

1) Remove cap from RCBS press and use the 10mm x 1.5 tap to thread the center hole of the cap.

2) Drill a 1/8" centered hole lengthwise through the the 10mm x 1.5 x 30mm hex bolt.

3) Using a cutoff wheel or hack saw, cut the hex head off the bolt.

4) Wrap all of the threads of the now headless bolt with two to three wraps of plumbers tape.

5) Thread the bolt into the RCBS cap from the top side, leaving about half the length of the bolt exposed.

6) Cut one foot (or whatever length you find suitable for your setup) from the PVC air hose.

7) Using the hose clamp, clamp the cut end of the hose onto to exposed end of the bolt protruding from the RCBS cap.

Threaded RCBS cap, drilled hex bolt:


Mated:


Cap assembly looks like this:
(shown with a quick disconnector attached to the 1/4" NPT fixture on the hose)



Making the base air tight:

1) Remove the threaded rod/mechanical pressure assembly from the lube reservoir. The press can easily be returned to mechanical pressurization, so be sure to store these parts, in case you need them again.

2) Using the gasket material, cut three circles 1.5" in diameter. A 1.5" fender washer makes a good template for this cut. Depending on your mounting system, you might need additional gasket thickness. Just add another 1.5" disk. I experimented with several different shapes of gaskets before settling on making these disks to fit into the bottom of the reservoir. This proved to be the most airtight solution.

3) Place the three circular gaskets in the opening at the bottom of the press and remount the press to your lube heater or work surface. This is more easily done if there is lube in the reservoir. Just push the gaskets onto the lube.

Gasket material in place:



Mating the cap to the RCBS body:

1) Clean off the top of the press so that nothing impedes the cap from being seated as tightly as possible.

2) Place the cap in the press (without the hose assembly attached). If possible, clamp it on firmly using a woodworking clamp, or whatever you have available.

3) On my press, there is only about 0.2" of mating between the cap and the press body, so I chose 4-40 screws to hold the cap to the body. I carefully marked and drilled #43 holes through the body, into the cap and then threaded the holes with the 4-40 tap.

Drilling and tapping these holes is the toughest part of the process, because the working area is small. Go slow. This needs to be a good fit.

Threading for 4-40 screws to hold the cap in place:


Cap held in place with 4-40 screws (one on each side):



Final assembly:

1) Reattach the hose to the cap.

2) Use some plumbers tape to make a seal around the edges of the cap. I used approximately four wraps around the circumferance of the cap.

3) Place the taped cap assembly in the body and fasten it in place with the screws.

Finished and working!



Additional comments:

First of all, I know this board is loaded with mechanical talent: Serious tinkerers, self-taught and formally trained machinists, engineers, inventors. I apologize if this project appears crude to the better trained eyes in the Castboolits community. I don't have a lot of metalworking experience, and my choices in this project were driven by tools on hand and low cost of experimentation.

My setup has a Lyman heater, and the lube in my press is LARS Red Carnauba. With the press fully warmed up, and a 358 sizing die in place, I found I could get lube to flow anywhere from 20psi to 40psi. I finally settled on about 32psi for good fillout. The only problem I ran into was when an air pocket reached the die, with a void all the way to the pressurized air in the reservoir. Air can then escape through the die as bullets are cycled, and the lube won't flow. I removed the cap assembly and used a wooden dowel to pack the lube down firmly in the reservoir, to purge any air pockets. I also melted another stick of lube and poured it in on top of the lube that was already in the press. Unfortunately, with the hollow stick lubes, you may have to go through this a couple of times until you've eliminated air pockets. Best way to avoid this is to start with any empty reservoir, and pour in melted lube. You can also melt the existing lube in the press by heating the press with a heat gun.

This setup is not air tight. It took some experimenting to figure out the right gasket configuration for the base (3 stacked disks), and I had to re-tape the cap a couple of times. Air still escapes, but at a very low rate, and the press seems to be able to hold pressure well. I have a 60 gallon compressor in my basement shop. Even with all of my experimenting over a few hours, the compressor never had to cycle on. This setup should be efficient even with small compressors, as long as you do a decent job of gasketing and taping the connections.

Once in operation, the thing was a pleasure to use. I haven't timed myself, but I suspect my throughput rate is going to double. I can keep one hand on the RCBS press lever at all times, with no reaching for the pressure wrench. The boolits fill out consistently, so I don't have to run some a second time.

Potential improvements? I could see mounting a standard NPT coupler directly onto the RCBS cap, and atop that, a pressure gage for being able to view and manipulate the air pressure without moving from the press.

And a safety note: Wear eye protection when working on this setup. By air tool standards, 32psi is low, but it's plenty enough pressure to get a small part flying fast enough for an eye injury.

[geargnasher]

Thanks for posting that! I was wondering how it would work without a piston on top of the lube, perhaps one could be made with a short piece of wire attached to it and coiled on top so it could be retrieved from the bottom of the reservoir when bottomed out.

I have a Lyman 450 and I wish you'd quit giving me ideas

Gear

[Lloyd Smale]

check out gussy website. Castingstuff.com. He makes a set up for the lyman and rcbs sizers that makes them simular to the star. It isnt air pressure but the spring pressure set up will allow you to size up to 50 bullets without touching the crank. I helped him test some of the original prototypes and they work well. I dont have one anymore as i went to stars for all my sizing but it may be a cheap alternative for someone who isnt handy enough to change theres over to air.

[prickett]

check out gussy website. Castingstuff.com. He makes a set up for the lyman and rcbs sizers that makes them simular to the star. It isnt air pressure but the spring pressure set up will allow you to size up to 50 bullets without touching the crank. I helped him test some of the original prototypes and they work well. I dont have one anymore as i went to stars for all my sizing but it may be a cheap alternative for someone who isnt handy enough to change theres over to air.

Went to castingstuff.com but didn't see this. Can you provide a direct link?

[cheese1566]

http://www.castingstuff.com/cabinetree_loading_products.htm

scroll down to Automatic Lube Feeder ALF

[hunter64]

rbstern: Great write up. I went to the garage to see if I could duplicate what you have done.

I have a lyman 450 and I disassembled it for a good cleaning and thought I would do what you have done because there is nothing more annoying than trying to get the correct pressure for the lube and having to do the same bullet twice.

I tried to get the pressure screw out but it looks like it is pressed in the seal plug and I am not sure if it will come out without being pounded out the bottom. Does anybody know? I tried unscrewing it from the bottom and I got about 1" than it quit. Numbers 8 and 9 on the diagram below.

http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/b...BC_LS_4500.pdf go to page 5 of the instructions and it has the parts for the 450 also.

Looks like it is staked in on 6 places so pushing it out would be no problem.

[rbstern]

hunter, thanks. Please take pics as you do this, if you don't mind. Would like to see the differences based on the designs of the two presses.