NEWS: ATF has decided to pull their proposed backdoor ammo ban!

[TES]

Gun load master...please contact me.

[TXGunNut]

Overheard a guy in a big box sporting goods store asking where the M855 ammo was. Pretty sure he had no idea what it was.
Bottom line: if they're able to ban M855 based on this premise they will be able to ban dozens of rifle cartridges. As has been pointed out police body armor is designed to defeat normal handgun ammo.

[MaryB]

I vote for banning their jobs and disbanding the ATF

Gotcha!

Ban , Ban , Ban!

Maybe we ought to start banning something that they like?

[waksupi]

Gun load master...please contact me.

Try the "contact" button at the bottom of the page, c/o Willie

[Pinsnscrews]

If you read the premise of the Ban, it is actually Already In Place

It is already illegal to use Armor Piercing Ammo in a Handgun. Therefore, the firing of M855 ammo out of a Registered Pistol such as a TC Contender or AR style Pistol is Illegal.

Rather than a Ban, the BATFE needs to Enforce the already exhisting law and require a Surgeon Generalish warning on M855 boxes stating "it is illegal to fire this and all Armor Piercing Ammo from a Pistol"

I am on my iPad or I would get out the exact wording and Code for the quote.

[dakotashooter2]

If you read the premise of the Ban, it is actually Already In Place

It is already illegal to use Armor Piercing Ammo in a Handgun. Therefore, the firing of M855 ammo out of a Registered Pistol such as a TC Contender or AR style Pistol is Illegal.

Rather than a Ban, the BATFE needs to Enforce the already exhisting law and require a Surgeon Generalish warning on M855 boxes stating "it is illegal to fire this and all Armor Piercing Ammo from a Pistol"

I am on my iPad or I would get out the exact wording and Code for the quote.

Actually single shot pistols are one of the exemptions.... It is the AR style pistols that have caused this hoopalah.......... But I agree...if someone uses it in a pistol charge them with the existing violation....... don't ban the ammo...........

[Defcon-One]

Also, the M855 is actually less lethal from a pistol with a short barrel than from a rifle barrel (Less velocity). There is no logic here only emotion and a scheme to disarm all of us so that they can do anything that they want, like Hillary!

If you think about it, they have already successfully limited free speech (1st Amendment) using PC tactics and Race....and anything else that they can use to sway the opinions of the uninformed masses we feed and house. Most are scared to speak out. Nobody says what they really think anymore, accept maybe places like this.

[fatelk]

There is a tremendous amount of misunderstanding and misinformation about this issue going around. It is actually NOT illegal to fire "AP" ammo in a pistol. It's not even illegal to own, at least in most states.

The pertinent law prohibits the manufacture or importation of it, or sale by licensed dealer to individuals. It's quite legal for individuals to possess, shoot, buy, sell, or trade. At least that's my understanding.

The issue also, as to what gets banned under this law, is not whether it can penetrate body armor, but actual bullet construction. Specifically the steel in the core is a problem.

The liberal democrat who wrote the law specifically said that it was not intended to apply to rifle ammo, or any ammo not designed for handguns, then a few years later they turned around and used it to ban the importation of steel core 7.62x39 that was as common and cheap as dirt at the time. The steel core in the M43 round was not designed as AP and certainly not designed for a handgun, but since the soft steel core could technically fit the specific wording of the law they banned it, even though it was clearly and openly a misapplication according to the intent of the law.

Personally I thought this proposed ban was a non-issue from a practical perspective. What's out there would still be out there, no difference, still legal to own and use or buy, sell, trade privately. New stuff would still be made and sold in quantity as always, except without the almost-worthless little steel piece hidden inside the tip or the pretty green paint outside.

Politically of course it's an important win. The stuff is not a public menace or danger to law enforcement officers. They were doing it for political reasons, to show their base that they're "doing something about guns", and they just got politically overpowered and shut down, for now.

[dakotashooter2]

Excellent points. Yes it is the sale and importation that would be effected. Sadly there are no real performance based standards in the regulation.

[fatelk]

Absolutely. The law was poorly written, shamelessly misapplied, and designed to solve a nonexistent problem.

[montana_charlie]

Personally I thought this proposed ban was a non-issue from a practical perspective. What's out there would still be out there, no difference, still legal to own and use or buy, sell, trade privately. New stuff would still be made and sold in quantity as always, except without the almost-worthless little steel piece hidden inside the tip or the pretty green paint outside.

Ever since the 2012 election, the price of M855 has been 'very high' ... increased from 300/1000 to 500/1000 almost immediately after the second election of Obama.

The price has been dropping very gradually for about a year, and had almost got back to the pre-election level.
For any who were interested in 'stockpiling' some SHTF ammo, it was about to become 'affordable' again.
Within 24 hours of this ban announcement, one dealer I pay attention to changed their price on M855 from 325/1000 to 700/1000.

Another pricing aspect of M855 is the fact that NATO countries are being pressured to switch to a 'green' (non-lead) bullet.
If adopted, that puts a VERY large amount of M855 on the surplus market ... creating an ammunition class that is cheap enough to plink with.

So, with the selling price becomming reasonable, again, and a probable future of 'better days', Obama's ATF takes this action that (if successful) will surely prevent any more large stockpiles of AR fodder in civilian hands ... probably result in destruction of any large, new, surplus supply ... AND pave the way for banning any type of centerfire rifle ammo if a repeating handgun is available to fire it.

I didn't view it as a non-issue ...

CM

[fatelk]

NATO countries are being pressured to switch to a 'green' (non-lead) bullet

that puts a VERY large amount of M855 on the surplus market

I didn't view it as a non-issue ...

I didn't think about the surplus angle. You are absolutely right!

[Smoke4320]

I vote for banning their jobs and disbanding the ATF

^ +1 +1 +1

[MaryB]

M855 IS NOT AP ammo! It doesn't fit the law as written for materials and construction. Military does not list it as AP either. It is cheap soon to be a lot of surplus that Dictator Obama wants to keep out of private hands. Rumor mill has it he s going to ban sale of military brass again so it won't be on the reloading market

[khmer6]

Overheard a guy in a big box sporting goods store asking where the M855 ammo was. Pretty sure he had no idea what it was.
Bottom line: if they're able to ban M855 based on this premise they will be able to ban dozens of rifle cartridges. As has been pointed out police body armor is designed to defeat normal handgun ammo.

This!!!! Some people have no idea! People are trying to pass off m193 ammo at higher prices Cuz they think it's m855. And yes they are trying to ban all rifle ammo. Can't take our guns but try to take our ammo. Don't know if much will come out of it. But if we don't fight and voice they can make up jargon and declare all rifle above 22lr as amor piercing which is absurd!!

[Lee]

Yeah right. And this Just in...IRS will stop collecting taxes. These control monsters won't stop until they control all. George Orwell must be up to 2000+ rpm in his grave right about now......
P.S. I've got land in the mid-Pacific for sale, any of you believe ANY of this gubmint hooey.....................

[tryNto]

Still time to let your Rep. know you don't want this ban.

https://www.nssf.org/GovRel/takeActi...?alertID=80492

[montana_charlie]

Still time to let your Rep. know you don't want this ban.

https://www.nssf.org/GovRel/takeActi...?alertID=80492

You better be hammering out those messages because now the Democrats in Congress are trying to get the ban reinstated ... and ATF Director B. Todd Jones [is saying] all types of the 5.56 military-style ammo used by shooters pose a threat to police ...
http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepa...&newsletterad=

[TXGunNut]

M855 IS NOT AP ammo! It doesn't fit the law as written for materials and construction. Military does not list it as AP either......

Just heard that this morning. Somehow I'm not sure that will keep them from banning it.

[John Guedry]

How 'bout they ban golf clubs ? Especially putters, small easy to conceal. Or maybe golf balls, deadly missiles looking for your innocent head.