22 cal jackets

[supe47]

So, what kind of a cruise missile do ya think you could make with a full length derimmed 22 mag case.
Top, full length 22 mag shell 1.291" OAL
Sierra 69gr HPBT MATCH .901" OAL
derimmed 22 LR .730" OAL
22 LR .608" OAL

Supe

[BT Sniper]

I haven't made any bullets from the derimed 22 mag case yet. I think it goes over 110 grains or more. A bit extreem for most 22 cals. I did cut off the 17HMRs at the shoulder and when derimed it gave me a 1.00ish lenght jacket. I would think that may be more realistic.

Fun to play with for sure, just be carfull when you guys get the point form die. The formed bullet will typicaly be just slightly longer then teh length of teh starting jacket.

I think I designed the point form die to be about 1.4" in length with the bullet cavity. I would be careful if attempting to make bullets approaching such a long length. I'll test to see just how long we can get away with but you guys might want to trim a bit of that 22 mag before deriming. You want to make sure the base punch is inside the base of the point form die before any pressure is added in the process of forming the point.

Don't forget to mention that deriming teh 22mag cases requires quite a bit more force then the standard 22lr. With a big Wallnut Hill press it is no problem but with a standard RCBS Supreme it is work.

Have fun and swage on!

BT

[Smokin7mm]

Using 22mag cases I have made 22cal bullets up to 100gr (still requires a little trimming). 6mm up to 115gr, 6.5mm up to about 126gr, .277 up to about 135gr, 7mm up to about 140gr.

Bret

[Bullshop]

Smokin7mm
So your saying you have made bullets up to 7mm cal using 22 mag brass for jackets? I would like to hear more about that.
I remember reading in one of Dave Corbins books that you might stretch them to 25 cal but larger than that would likely split the jacket.
I would be interested in hearing your procedure. I would also be interested in hearing about how the finished bullets perform both in accuracy and in terminal performance. For me the 22 LR jackets are explosive in the 22 and 6mm cal I use them in.
I have found that they can be very accurate but are more limited to powders that will work well at near top end velocity. They seem to prefer the slower gentler push of a slower powder for best accuracy. With the softer thinner jackets they seem similer to cast boolits in that reguard.

[Smokin7mm]

Bullshop,
The process I have worked up is basicly I expand them up to a couple of thousands under final diameter just like a normal jacket. A 25acp shell holder fits the 22mag case. I made up a expander plug to fit in the top of a standard loading press. It kinda looks like the expanders in the TCU series of dies kinda elliptical to reduce drag. I run them in as far as I can (basically until the expansion almost touches the shell holder). If you go farther it almost swages the case into the shell holder and you can't get them out very easily. You gotta use lube inside the case to ease this expanding. I then use my 6mm derim die to remove the rim on my swaging press. I only run it in far enough to remove the rim and then knock it out the bottom with the supplied punch that came with my die (RCE). I think the punch is for removing a jacket from the die if the end pops off but it works perfect for removing the derimmed case. I usually anneal before I derim for this process as I found if I didn't the case would stick on the punch making it difficult to get the jacket off the punch. I then seat a core and it expands out the lower portion of the jacket to final diameter for a flat base bullet. If I am making boattails it is even better as the derimmed 6mm portion of the bottom of the case is close to the bottom of the boattail on the 6.5 & 7mm bullets and requires less filling out.
Yes the jackets are thin (about .009). I have shot the 6.5mm in my TC 6.5TCU for silhouette and gotten some decent scores 38's & 39's in production class. Every once in a while I have missed a chicken with a good hold and can only assume that a jacket had a weak or thin spot from expanding and may have been cut by the rifling and come apart because I don't see dust fly close to the target (maybe 6" off the target). I have done minimal testing with the 7mm but have shot some in my 7TCU. The 277 I have tried in my 270REN (80 & 90gr) and gotten results on par with Remington 100gr bulk bullets. Velocities for the 6.5 & 7MM were kept around 1800fps and the 270REN at about 1100fps. It is fun to expeiment with. With the cost of berger jackets in the 6.5 & 7mm running around 32¢ each I am alway looking at options.

Bret

[Bullshop]

I have been enlightened!!! Thank you for that. I think it was Ronald Reagan that said something like the problem is not what they dont know but what they think they know but is not true. I was there but you fixed it.
So I wounder what they would do in like a 280 Rem or 7 mag.
About a week ago I was out calling coyotes near a small stock pond. I was watching a muskrat for awhile and thought if I dont get a coyote from this stand I will at least get the muskrat. A $4.00 rat is better than no fur at all. I was shooting a 221 fireball with a 17" barrel, my call gun loaded with 52gn bullets swaged from 22 LR jackets.
I waited for him to look straight at me thinking the little bullet would hit him in the nose and just stay inside. WRONG!!!!
It was a rat bomb good only for trap bait.

[runfiverun]

dan i was having the opposite problem on ground squirells.
i was using a harder core and not annealing the jaxket at any time,or leaving any lead exposed.
the bullets would kill them but they were zipping on through like a cast boolit does.
i shot a yote running away from me in the hind quarter at about 80 yds and little girl could see the bullet exit the front and hit dirt through her scope from her vantage point.
it yelped for about 300 yds before laying down.
after that i started [initially] annealing just the nose of the jaxket and that was producing some better results,but not efficient kills [explosive] i wanted on the little guy's.
so i went further down to the ogive [with the case anneal] and i raised my core weight just enough [0.3 grs airc] to get some lead to the tip of the bullet.

[Smokin7mm]

Bullshop,
Not sure how they would work in larger case capacity rounds. What I have found it is a combination of velocity and twist that will cause a bullet to come apart. I shot some 107gr 6mm bullets made from 22mag cases in a XP-100 in 6TCU. It has a 1-7 twist and they seemed to shoot fine at around 2200fps. My buddy tried them in an identical barrel on a 6BR (we had the guns built at the same time by the same guy, same barrel, just different caliber) He was pushing his at around 2500fps and not all the bullets were not making it to the target. Now I tried these same bullets in 100gr out of my 243 winchester in a rifle at around 2900fps and didnt have any problems but it is a 1-10 twist. This leads me to believe that the faster twist puts more stress on the bullet.
The 7mm bullets I was trying was in a 7TCU with 1-10 twist and I was only pushing around 1900fps. The only way find out is to test them. I have a few more laying around that I made but havent had the time to continue testing.

Bret

[ANeat]

A 22mag case as mentioned will give you 100+ grain, depending of course on the core, also might depend on how deep your die is.

Here is a lead slug ran thru the die, a 100+gr 223 bullet that was made from a 6mm jacket stretched out, and a 100+ gr from a 22mag jacket.

I never got around to testing but my intention was a sub sonic 223 that had a little more energy than just running 55 grainers at 1000 fps

[Bullshop]

runfiverun
I am annealing my jackets in a pipe bomb in a wood stove. The pipe bomb is about 18" length of 3" diameter steel pipe with a threaded cap on each end and a touch pressure release) hole drilled. 15 minutes in the stove is about right. When the jackets are cooled you can crush them between you finger and thumb. With those I use pure lead cores.
These work real nice from my 22 ccm at under 2000 fps but pushed much beyond that and they are explosive.
Smokin7mm
You are right about the twist thing and likely bore condition as well same as with cast boolits.
I make a 100 to 110gn 6mm bullet using two 22rf jackets. It is a dual jacket arrangment with one inside the other.
I have not tried to push them to the limit of a 10" twist 243 but they did work well at 243 starting loads. They work really good in a 10" twist 6x45.

[Smokin7mm]

On another note on twist. I also tried these 107gr in a XP-100 in 6BR with a 1-8" twist. I did not chronograph these (put the Ohler 35P in the truck the night before and it got below freezing that night and when I got to the range it had a dead battery) but I am guessing the velocities were in the 2200-2400fps range and they all made it to the target. More testing will tell what the limits are on twist and velocity.
Bret

[Smokin7mm]

[QUOTE=ANeat;1927562]A 22mag case as mentioned will give you 100+ grain, depending of course on the core, also might depend on how deep your die is.

Here is a lead slug ran thru the die, a 100+gr 223 bullet that was made from a 6mm jacket stretched out, and a 100+ gr from a 22mag jacket.

I never got around to testing but my intention was a sub sonic 223 that had a little more energy than just running 55 grainers at 1000 fps

ANeat,
I made up some 100gr 22cal bullets from 22mag cases for a buddy of mine to use in a XP-100 22BR for silhouette that look just like that. He wanted something a little heavier than the available 90gr bullets. The thing he found is that with the long bearing surface you have to start low (way low) and work up looking for pressure. He almost froze a bolt with a starting book load for a 90gr. No real available data for 100gr 22's. Once he found a load he said they were real accurate.
Bret

[Lizard333]

You have to get a die with a longer ogive, a VLD is much better suited than the standard 6S. This allows you to seat the boolit further into the chamber, giving you more room for powder, allowing you to decrease the pressure.

[onomrbil]

Jacket trim die. Use it to get whatever length u want.