Best Powder for reloading 223 LR bullets?

[Swede44mag]

I read someware it might have been Corbin's website that not to push the .22LR jacketed bullets as fast cause the jackets will be thinner and may not take the speed. (Turn to dust when the leave the barrel) if my memory serves me correctly.

I have been following your Die making process it is very interesting.

[tomme boy]

H322 works very well up to 55gr. Also uses less powder at the same time. Win 748 is another favorite.

One thing you might have a problem with is the barrel itself. Savage is not known to have a very smooth barrel. They do shoot good, but foul very bad. I would get some 52-53gr HPBT match bullets first to work up a good load to break in the barrel first. That way, you will have something to compare to. If it does not shoot the Sierras HPBT match then something is wrong. JMHO

[mnkyracer]

I use Benchmark in a Rem 799, Sierra 55 gr varmiters. Meters well for me with RCBS uniflow measure.

[Mountain Prepper]

I have been working with IMR 4198 and switched from Varget to a lower velocity load with IMR 4198.

I have never had a ‘full-house” max load in .223 that ever shot as well as medium to low has.

[Rollis]

The Dillon measure that I, use with 2230 has not been adjusted for two years, and it throw right at 25 grn. With my Lyman 55 I, will get a little bit of cutting with the stick powders, but the meter great.

[fishnbob]

I have found the Ball Powder, especially H-380 and BLC-2 to be very pressure sensitive in hot weather and somewhat so in cooler weather. I cannot begin to load near the manual's suggested maximum load data. Most times I am stuck around the suggested starting load especially in hot weather. 4198 works good for me and meters pretty good for a stick powder. After nearly 50 yrs. of reloading, I have come to the self-denied conclusion that consistent powder charges may not be the lone factor in accuracy on the paper!

[firefly1957]

I have had very good results with a wide range of bullet weights with IMR-3031 I have made some as light as 39 grs that shot about 2" groups at 100 yards when loaded at minimum (3200fps) at near max about 3600 they patterned on the paper instead of grouping. As a side experiment I loaded some 55 gr bullets that were shooting .75" 100 yard groups out of my Rossi Rifle(.223), in sabots with 30-06 at about 3300 they shot ok (3-4 inches) at 100 yds at around 4000 fps they shot two inch groups the same as my 180 hunting load and almost with the same point of impact? In the past This Rifle shot better I have it apart to rebed the action as accuracy fell off I have owned the rifle (30-06) since 1973. A note on the Rossi it has a very light barrel and will shoot quite well "IF" the barrel is supported the same with each shot. If you support the barrel in different places you can move your groups 6 inches at 100 yds with that thin barrel and break open action. different loads also shoot to different points of impact. The Rossi rifle has a 1 in 12 twist also.

[CWME]

I will second the comments on testing with Sierra 52-53 HPBTs. I have had two Savage barrels that were not very smooth from the factory. A 6.5-284 on my F-class that I had a hard time getting a patch down when it was brand new. That barrel would not shoot anything under an inch. I burned it up testing to find a load it would shoot.

Anyway, I love Savage rifles and am NOT trashing them. But the barrels can be hit or miss. And I mention it due to your thin jackets.

Mcgowen makes AWESOME pre fit barrels. I am currently working with a $200 small shank ER Shaw 14 twist 223 from MidwayUSA that is very impressive. This replaced the second factory barrel that was not a good shooter.

I have drifted from Varget to RE-15 to the ball powders and back to RE-15. I use RE-15 in all my match stuff now. Consistent, meters ok, great accuracy etc. No need to measure every charge with RE-15. 600 yard tests showed no variations in vertical from loads that were measured to loads that were thrown. Good powder!

The ball powders gave me a lot of vertical stringing at long range in multiple platforms. BLC-2 was the best of them during my tests. 2520 was not to bad.

Disclamer, I have not had the pleasure of making my own 22LR bullets yet. Was going to try Danr's set but the swage down deal lost me. Looking forward to you getting yours up to speed. Put me on your list of interested people.

[Grandpas50AE]

BT,
With that rifling you can easily shoot the heavier bullets and get really good results. I have used the rimfire jackets to make a 65 gr. 6-S spitzer that will shoot under inside a quarter at 100 yards, and if I change to the J-4 jackets it comes out to 69.5 gr. I have an RRA AR-15 with 1-9 twist, and it shoots those heavier bullets really well. I have used H322, AA2230, and BLC-2, and didn't really get consistent results over the chronograph with the AA2230. H322 worked very well, as does BLC-2. My brother has just started experimenting with Varget, so whenever he gets done playing with it I'll find out how he likes it and what his results are for you. If staying with the 55 gr. pillls, I have heard that Varget may not give the consistent results some of the other powders do, but do not know how true that is. For 55 gr. FMJ BT's I have gotten excellent results with BLC-2.

Hope this helps.

[BT Sniper]

Lots of good recamendations. I think I'll be leaning towards slightly heavier bullets with the LR brass. Heavy enough to completely fill the jacket. What ever weight that will be. Around 60-65 I imagine. I expect to get better results from a bullet I can apply a bit of pressure to while forming then a 55 grain hollow nose bullet. That's just my theory at the moment though.

Great thread, I look foward to more posts and some of my own soon.

Thanks

BT

[Shooter6br]

H322 with 50-55 grainers is good.

[firefly1957]

BT Sniper I think My dies are made by Pacific and they actually make a light bullet that shoots very well as long as I properly anneal the brass so it does not wrinkle at the point. My 2 .223's have a 1-12 and a 1-10 twist so they would not shoot well for me but a 70 gr bullet was about ideal for a softpoint. ( I am not using pure lead so with soft lead it would be heavier)

[dale2242]

Brian, I have shot 1000s of junkyard bullets made from 22rf cases. I bought 20k of the a few years ago to shoot sage rats.
I am shooting 26gr of 4895 with these bullets in the 50-55gr range because I have a 20# keg of it. Measuring is is not an issue because I use the Hownady Auto Charge.
If you are worried about metering go to a ball type or short grained stick powder......dale

[GRUMPA]

BT I really don't want to tell you what you may already know. But what the heck I'll do it anyway, twist rates vary as I hope most know. For a 55gr whatever the standard 1-9 to 1-10 twist is fine. The heavier they get the faster the twist rate needs to be in order to stabilize the projectile. I have 2 different types with one being 1-7 and the other is 1-9 twist rate. If I shoot anything over will say 68gr in the 1-9 twist rate at 100yds my patterns open up from 1/2in at 100yds to just over an inch. If I use the same dang boolit in the 1-7 twist barrel I can still keep real good accuracy at 100yds.

When you start doing field testing it's best to have a fast rate of twist to stabilize the projectile when different weights are used. Otherwise your going to wonder why group "A" shot well but when it came time to evaluate group "B" things aren't the same. And what powder is used is still important, your eliminating the margin of error when using a fast twist rate barrel.

[martin]

Grumpa and BT,

I believe what Grumpa is driving at is that twist rates play a critical role in determining which projectiles are best suited. I have found that the "Greenhill" formula provides a pretty good foundation as a starting point. If you look this up on the internet you will find a bunch of information and calculators which are a great help in explaining external ballistics and stabaliztion in terms of twist rates vs. physical bullet size.

Best regards,
Martin

[shooterg]

What Grumpa said. Especially in say 20" AR barrels. Some longer barrels in 1:9, 1:10 seem to be OK with 69 gr. or close j-words. My 1:7, 1:8 barrels are fine up to 80 gr. Have a 24" 1:9 that will shoot 52 g. Sierra up to 73 gr. Berger great, 75 gr. Hornady, 77 gr. Sierra change the group to a shotgun pattern ! Mw guess - 52 to 56 gr. of your flat based swaged bullets will be the best performers in your Savage.

[AF FAL]

I don't have any of my load notes with me, but IMR 8208 XBR pushing a 6o gr Vmax. 23gr will get around 3000FPS, and is a little shy of max load listings. That is commercial brass.

Working on getting the swaging set up still. I hear 22 mag/17HMR brass is supposed to be thicker, thought it may be worth cutting it down to use for faster .223 bullets from rimfire brass. I shoot 17HMR and can get 22mag brass from the range barrel by the bucket.

[algunjunkie]

25 grains of TAC with a 55gr bullet, rimfire or factory both shoot well.

[Hickory]

I have been making and shooting bullets made from 22 RF cases for nearly 30 years. And have used a wide variety of powders and the only consideration a person should keep in mind is velocity.

In rough barrels (Factory barrels) keep the velocity at or around 3200 fps and 3400 fps with a button rifled (Smooth) custom barrels.

[OneShotNeeded]

BT
Don't know if you've come up w/ a load yet but my savage ad my Ar's love 55g flat base bullet, w/ 27grns Varget and a 210m Match federal primer. 3/4 sub moa @100yrds. I don't swage RF jackets into bullets but have been looking at getting a set of Danr dies.... just waiting for the right moment.