My homemade black powder

[Swineherd]

Making your own powder is gratifying.
You can use just the meal itself to fire a gun.
Screening is better than that, but compressing the powder results in a very substantially better end product. It's definitely worth doing if you can source a press and die. The die can be made yourself reasonably easy. And, it's less work, once you're set up, than screening and drying wet meal.

[indian joe]

I've got my first batch of ailanthus powder ready to sort and grade. Can y'all direct me to a source of the proper sieves?

Attachment 318450

those are the screen sizes I use - not that it a big deal - consistency is the main aim

I'd like to get 2F to 3F powder.

Another question: The stuff is drying. It's fairly dry already. When I priced it through window screen it ended up like black rice-a-roni. Now it's kind of all clumped together in junks. How do I get it down to granules?

soon as it starts to dry work it back through the screen again until the grains stay separate - I have a 6 x 3 table with sides around and drape an old bedsheet over it to catch the stuff coming thrugh the scren - have a 4 x 2 window screen set on blocks about 8 inches above the sheet - the trick with screened powder is work it as its drying

[indian joe]

Making your own powder is gratifying.
You can use just the meal itself to fire a gun.
Screening is better than that, but compressing the powder results in a very substantially better end product. It's definitely worth doing if you can source a press and die. The die can be made yourself reasonably easy.

And, it's less work, once you're set up, than screening and drying wet meal.

I disagree with that last bit I make screened powder for all my muzzleloader shooting because it is so much easier and quicker than pressing pucks etc

Its probably easier to get in a mess with screened but but once you figure out the process its much more productive

Also I have tested that screened is at least equal in energy to pressed powder on a grain for grain basis

The lower density of screened is only an issue in cartridge guns

some of the differences probably come down to how you have gear set up --I will always do screen granulation for front loaders and cap pistols.

[Swineherd]

I disagree with that last bit I make screened powder for all my muzzleloader shooting because it is so much easier and quicker than pressing pucks etc

Its probably easier to get in a mess with screened but but once you figure out the process its much more productive

Also I have tested that screened is at least equal in energy to pressed powder on a grain for grain basis

The lower density of screened is only an issue in cartridge guns

some of the differences probably come down to how you have gear set up --I will always do screen granulation for front loaders and cap pistols.

Screening, for me, was messy and slow.
You're right about density being an issue primarily for cartridges, but I load plenty of them, so I may as well press everything. Keeps things simple.

I suppose once you're sending lead, the rest is just preference and details.

[shaman]

My plan has been to do the first batch with ricing through a screen and see how it works in the Brown Bess. My goal was to see if the ailanthus I have growing in the back yard in-town would make good charcoal. I made my 1 gallon can full of sticks from 2 trees about 10 feet high.

From there, I eventually hope to try corned powder. My buddy over on the next ridge has offered the services of his hydraulic press. That's some time down the road.

From what I've seen so far the riced stuff is energetic and fast burning. I tried a bit of the extras that fell out while I was ricing and dried on the patio. Yowzah!

The ailanthus grows all over the place around here. If further testing reveals it'll push a ball out of the 'Bess, my goal next year will be to harvest a bunch of it and cook it as needed. I also plan to use that as a baseline for comparative testing to red cedar. I've got scads of that stuff at the farm, as well as fast-growning water maple. I'm loathe to transplant ailanthus there for obvious reasons, but I have an inlaw with a bunch of it on his property and can harvest it whenever I need it.

What I expect to happen is that I'll get proficient at producing a pound or so a year and keep a stockpile of ingredients for a . . . rainy day.

[indian joe]

Screening, for me, was messy and slow.
You're right about density being an issue primarily for cartridges, but I load plenty of them, so I may as well press everything. Keeps things simple.

I suppose once you're sending lead, the rest is just preference and details.

I am inherently lazy - I would not continue with screened powder if the process was not a whole lot more efficient and productive - all I can think is the difference comes down to equipment setup (or attitude? we all been told many times how superior corned powder is) ---we burn at least half or more of our powder in muzzleloaders and cap pistols so an advantage is worth chasing.

[Swineherd]

I am inherently lazy - I would not continue with screened powder if the process was not a whole lot more efficient and productive - all I can think is the difference comes down to equipment setup (or attitude? we all been told many times how superior corned powder is) ---we burn at least half or more of our powder in muzzleloaders and cap pistols so an advantage is worth chasing.

Sounds like you've got your processes dialed in.
You're right about the attitude thing, I wasn't really motivated to refine the wet ricing method of granulation, I just did it out of excitement to create a finished product of some kind to begin with. I really did start the home brew endeavor with the end goal of producing the fastest, cleanest burning and most energy dense powder possible. I started pucking and didn't find it any more a nuisance than wetting and grating powder, less so imho. And I use a hand crank grain mill to granulate after breaking the pucks in half with a mallet. Then I sift the results. The granules are more dense and more durable than riced. Soon I'll start experimenting with tumbling the grains with a bit of graphite.

[Swineherd]

My plan has been to do the first batch with ricing through a screen and see how it works in the Brown Bess. My goal was to see if the ailanthus I have growing in the back yard in-town would make good charcoal. I made my 1 gallon can full of sticks from 2 trees about 10 feet high.

From there, I eventually hope to try corned powder. My buddy over on the next ridge has offered the services of his hydraulic press. That's some time down the road.

From what I've seen so far the riced stuff is energetic and fast burning. I tried a bit of the extras that fell out while I was ricing and dried on the patio. Yowzah!

The ailanthus grows all over the place around here. If further testing reveals it'll push a ball out of the 'Bess, my goal next year will be to harvest a bunch of it and cook it as needed. I also plan to use that as a baseline for comparative testing to red cedar. I've got scads of that stuff at the farm, as well as fast-growning water maple. I'm loathe to transplant ailanthus there for obvious reasons, but I have an inlaw with a bunch of it on his property and can harvest it whenever I need it.

What I expect to happen is that I'll get proficient at producing a pound or so a year and keep a stockpile of ingredients for a . . . rainy day.

I like your plan. And testing the locally available charcoal feedstock, smart.

[shaman]

I like your plan. And testing the locally available charcoal feedstock, smart.

If I have any intelligence on this subject, it comes from reading this thread.

[Swineherd]

If I have any intelligence on this subject, it comes from reading this thread.

I've gotten a lot of good info here as well.

[lead chucker]

I have noticed that by pressing the powder into pucks and letting them dry and grinding them in a grain grinder and screening the end result is harder grains that dont break down as easy as doing the wet packed ball draging it a across a screen method. I have done that when first learning and was impressed with what i made it definitely works but the grains seem mor fragile or i was not doing it right. I like to press my gun meal and do it that way, works for me. It does take a bit more work thats for sure but for me its a hobby and i like doing this stuff.

[lead chucker]

Indian Joe has given me a lot of advise is the past on doing the wet screen method and it works so any one wanting to do that he is a great guy and im sure he would answere any questions about it. He helped me out alot when i was trying to learn.

[lead chucker]

Wet screening is the fast way to get into making your powder grains from BP once you make it and requires less equipment to get you going with this great hobby. Once you have done that you can take it to the next level, Corning the powder if you want.

[HWooldridge]

I have noticed that by pressing the powder into pucks and letting them dry and grinding them in a grain grinder and screening the end result is harder grains that dont break down as easy as doing the wet packed ball draging it a across a screen method. I have done that when first learning and was impressed with what i made it definitely works but the grains seem mor fragile or i was not doing it right. I like to press my gun meal and do it that way, works for me. It does take a bit more work thats for sure but for me its a hobby and i like doing this stuff.

I got the exact same results - my first batches were done by pushing the damp ball through a colander. The powder burned OK, but I got a lot of fines off of it. I started making pucks and grinding in a grain mill; the amount of usable grains increased from about 50% to maybe 80% on first pass. The fines then get compressed again and ground a second time. The amount of fines in two grinds is minimal but I keep them and add to subsequent batches.

[indian joe]

Sounds like you've got your processes dialed in.
You're right about the attitude thing, I wasn't really motivated to refine the wet ricing method of granulation, I just did it out of excitement to create a finished product of some kind to begin with. I really did start the home brew endeavor with the end goal of producing the fastest, cleanest burning and most energy dense powder possible. I started pucking and didn't find it any more a nuisance than wetting and grating powder, less so imho. And I use a hand crank grain mill to granulate after breaking the pucks in half with a mallet. Then I sift the results. The granules are more dense and more durable than riced. Soon I'll start experimenting with tumbling the grains with a bit of graphite.

I started out to make muzzleloader powder and we got that figured out early - willow charcoal and it was way cleaner burning (less fouling problems than anything I had shot to that point) I was hooked right there. Might not have taken it any further except one of the boys here said something to the effect of "yeah we can do this for short range and plinking but never gonna be able to make it good enough for cartridge shooting at longer ranges" -----welllllll lets just see about that eh?
So made a press and dies and went through that learning process (with lots of help from others here) - got a chronygraph and got my cartridge powder loads down into single digit extreme spreads for ten shot strings (not wiping between shots either)
Consistency is my big deal

You are right the corned grains are more dense (way more) and more durable than screened ------but ------ I am shooting the last of my screened powder now from 2018 - its still almost as sound as when it went in the can - "not as durable" sure but plenty good enough!!!

Graphite ??? not going there !!! -----I have been shooting ungraphited powder for 25 years ---kinda got used to it ---we used to buy UG Goex 5FA - accumulated quite a stash of it at one point . There pros and cons for both sides - the shiny stuff is a bit easier to measure, little bit slower, little bit more fouling -- not a big deal either way -- for me one less thing to do

[Swineherd]

I agree if a guy can eliminate a step in the process without giving up anything important to his particular use, it's the way to go. Time isn't money, it's actually WAY more valuable. Got to thinking on graphite because I want my powder to do a bit better at metering out of the brass CVA powder measure I use. It doesn't flow through the thumb operated valve anywhere near as well a commercial stuff. So, maybe another cycle in the mill jar, without media, and a shake through one more screen will be worth the extra convenience while in actually shooting. I've read another benefit is knocking off the rough edges helps the powder become more resistant to absorbing water. Makes sense to me.

[LAGS]

I found.
That if I press the powder , break it up to the different grades then take the 2f and tumble it for about a half hour with out grinding media.
When re sifted again.
It seems more round and turns a lot into 3f.
That rounded 3f measures a lot better , and so does the stuff that sifts out to 2f.
Yes , you do end up with some more 4f.
But I don't measure my 4f for using in my flash pan.

[Swineherd]

I found.
That if I press the powder , break it up to the different grades then take the 2f and tumble it for about a half hour with out grinding media.
When re sifted again.
It seems more round and turns a lot into 3f.
That rounded 3f measures a lot better , and so does the stuff that sifts out to 2f.
Yes , you do end up with some more 4f.
But I don't measure my 4f for using in my flash pan.

What's your mill time on the finished powder?
Since most every one has a bit of a unique milling setup, I should ask: What's the mill time for finished powder when represented as a percentage of the mill time for your meal?

If you mill your meal 10 hours, is the finishing mill time 2 hours (20%) or?

Just trying to get a baseline to begin with.

[LAGS]

My final mill time of the three chemicals is min. 4 hours.
But.
I mill all three chemicals Separate for a min if 4 hours Each.
So the final milling is just fine mixing.
They say that longer is better.
But what I make is great as it is.

[indian joe]

I agree if a guy can eliminate a step in the process without giving up anything important to his particular use, it's the way to go. Time isn't money, it's actually WAY more valuable. Got to thinking on graphite because I want my powder to do a bit better at metering out of the brass CVA powder measure I use. It doesn't flow through the thumb operated valve anywhere near as well a commercial stuff. So, maybe another cycle in the mill jar, without media, and a shake through one more screen will be worth the extra convenience while in actually shooting. I've read another benefit is knocking off the rough edges helps the powder become more resistant to absorbing water. Makes sense to me.

I get the metering thing - you definitely need to pay attention with ungraphited powder
1) like I said - after 25 years of UG - have got used to it
2) mainly shoot on the range and our competition rules are - a separate single measure to convey the powder to the muzzle - so your CVA thumb spout measure would be a hindrance under those rules - I prefer to use a horn with plug into a brass measure - "they" would rather me use separate little plastic pill bottles with pre weighed charges - not doin that!
3) if I thought my results on the target would improve (any at all) I would be doin the graphite and after milling.

Am skeptical about the moisture absorbtion thing - wet powder is wet powder I reckon - I am careful and have a good (dry) environment, after almost five years my screened, ungraphited, untumbled powder is still running free of clumps from the container - I make darn sure it is DRY before I store it.